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old_user3144
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Message 14106 - Posted: 4 Jul 2005, 23:24:41 UTC
Last modified: 5 Jul 2005, 11:31:58 UTC

Ok, i made their job and calculated from my results page, here is the result:
I'm missing 850,67 credits which results in 9 trickles missing. Shouldn't be that difficult to calculate with a script, i needed 2 minutes using my browser and the calculator. A script would have done that in milliseconds...
[edit] Just another trickle sent, make that 10 trickles and 945,19 credits missing...

greetz, Uli<br /><br /><img border="0" src="http://boinc.mundayweb.com/one/stats.php?userID=501" /><br />
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crandles
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Message 14109 - Posted: 5 Jul 2005, 10:25:27 UTC - in response to Message 14094.  
Last modified: 5 Jul 2005, 10:26:35 UTC

&gt;
&gt; Which actually would have been the absolute right way, because people <b>know
&gt; and understand</b> that at times projects are not available if it is properly
&gt; announced.
&gt; But a message on the frontpage stating the project is not available would
&gt; surely not have been a good advertising match for <a> href="http://www.climateprediction.net/newsb.php?id=2"&gt;that</a>
&gt; Instead they put the head in the sand and let the people run into the open
&gt; knife. That's <b>my</b> point of view. Comments welcome...
&gt;

I am with Thyme Lawn on this. Delayed credits is far less serious than stopping people downloading new models and stopping people joining the project. (If the science was being affected then I would agree with you Ulrich but I see no reason to think the science is affected.)

There was a problem of lack of information from the team between 15th and 20th but since then we have had quite a lot of messages coming out keeping us informed. We could wish for more and better consistency of information in news section and the real position. However, I am sure it was believed the servers were up when they posted that and it was just unfortunate timing. Also, we will always be wanting more and better information. So I don't accept that they put their head in the sand.

Would you want SETI to stop sending out work units just because a validator was going to build up a large backlog before clearing it? Clearly SETI doesn't do that and neither should CPDN.
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old_user3144
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Message 14114 - Posted: 5 Jul 2005, 11:48:24 UTC - in response to Message 14109.  
Last modified: 5 Jul 2005, 13:38:31 UTC

&gt; I am with Thyme Lawn on this. Delayed credits is far less serious than
&gt; stopping people downloading new models and stopping people joining the
&gt; project. (If the science was being affected then I would agree with you Ulrich
&gt; but I see no reason to think the science is affected.)

I want to believe ;) that science isn't affected, but not seeing the data graphs from the missing trickles i can't do that. I may reconsider this, <b>if, and only if</b> my models make it to the server and i really <b>see</b> the graph, <b>not 1 second before</b>. My trust in this project is deepliest convulsed now.

&gt; There was a problem of lack of information from the team between 15th and 20th
&gt; but since then we have had quite a lot of messages coming out keeping us
&gt; informed. We could wish for more and better consistency of information in news
&gt; section and the real position. However, I am sure it was believed the servers
&gt; were up when they posted that and it was just unfortunate timing. Also, we
&gt; will always be wanting more and better information. So I don't accept that
&gt; they put their head in the sand.

If the communication to the community is already bad, then they should additionally consider improving communication among themselves.

&gt; Would you want SETI to stop sending out work units just because a validator
&gt; was going to build up a large backlog before clearing it? Clearly SETI doesn't
&gt; do that and neither should CPDN.

You can't compare CPDN and SETI in that condition. Loosing a SETI unit is 2-5 hrs wasted. Loosing a CPDN model is <b>much much</b> more damage to science and crunchers dedication. Have you, by chance, seen how Einstein managed their last shipwreck? They immediately stopped distribution and <b>informed</b> the people about the disaster and <b>even said 'Thank you'</b> (edit: <a href="http://einstein.phys.uwm.edu/forum_thread.php?id=2414#14607">Link to Bruce Allen's Post</a> ) to the people showing the mistake instead of calling them crybabies. It was the problem, that Windoze ignores lower-/uppercase differences in file names. I will rest my comments for now and crunch on with much lower percentage to CPDN. Let's see, how this evolves. <b>No harm meant!</b>
greetz, Uli<br /><br /><img border="0" src="http://boinc.mundayweb.com/one/stats.php?userID=501" /><br />
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Message 14117 - Posted: 5 Jul 2005, 14:02:50 UTC

Someone care to explain this: on my <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/results.php?userid=16558">WUs page</a> the sum of credits given equals to 16351.53, which is correct. Yet on my <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/show_user.php?userid=16558">user page</a> it says 15784.42. Notice the difference of 567.11 credits = 6 trickles?

Happy trickle chasing,
<img border="0" src="http://boinc.mundayweb.com/one/stats.php?userID=2086">
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Message 14119 - Posted: 5 Jul 2005, 15:04:01 UTC - in response to Message 14114.  


&gt;
&gt; I want to believe ;) that science isn't affected, but not seeing the data
&gt; graphs from the missing trickles i can't do that. I may reconsider this,
&gt; <b>if, and only if</b> my models make it to the server and i really <b>see</b>
&gt; the graph, <b>not 1 second before</b>. My trust in this project is deepliest
&gt; convulsed now.
&gt;

The graphs come from processing the gm trickles. These have nothing to do with the science upload at the end of the model so that is not a good thing to trust.

Likewise the Over-Success-Done status comes from yet another report (separate from trickles, gm trickles, and the science upload) so that is not a good thing to trust either.

Unfortunately, I don't have much that you can sensibly trust.

When asked for a method, Carl did suggest that you look to see if the 'work_unit_name_1.zip' through 'work_unit_name_5.zip' files had disappeared off your computer. This is the part of the work that is valuable to the team and therefore they will have been most careful here that the files will only be deleted if they have been sucessfully uploaded. I would prefer there was some better way of checking such as being able to query the number of KB uploaded for a resultid. (However I am aware of there being other priorities.)

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Profile Thyme Lawn
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Message 14125 - Posted: 5 Jul 2005, 16:53:20 UTC - in response to Message 14117.  
Last modified: 5 Jul 2005, 16:56:15 UTC

&gt; Someone care to explain this: on my <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/results.php?userid=16558">WUs page</a> the sum of credits given
&gt; equals to 16351.53, which is correct. Yet on my <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/show_user.php?userid=16558">user page</a> it says 15784.42.
&gt; Notice the difference of 567.11 credits = 6 trickles?

It's almost certainly related to Carl's post <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/forum_thread.php?id=2830#14111">here</a>.
<br><a href="http://www.teampicard.net/"><img src="http://www.teampicard.net/images/picardmini.gif"></a><a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/team_display.php?teamid=3">Join us here</a>
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Message 14179 - Posted: 7 Jul 2005, 1:18:08 UTC

I am dropping BOINC. I have waited almost three weeks now. Just as when I tried CPDN classic last year, I don't have the warm and cozy feeling everything is good enough to risk all those hours. There are more projects such as orbit@home, planetquest, and folding@home which are coming on line and I can try. My one computer probably can't crunch everything I like, so this seems a good time to cut back. I think CPDN is a great project, but again there is just too much to lose and too many things that are not going right after a year of BOINCing.
<img src="http://www.boincsynergy.com/images/stats/comb-744.jpg">
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Les Bayliss
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Message 14182 - Posted: 7 Jul 2005, 1:43:45 UTC

Everything has now been fixed.
And you are not dropping BOINC, you are dropping CPDN.
But if you're not happy here, there are indeed, lots of other projects.

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